Campagne Khalkhin Gol 39 (WIP)

[PatCartier]

J'essaie de croiser les infos / batailles aériennes du 22 juin: pas facile de s'y retrouver ! Les récits du n°50 de B.A. et de la page internet citée par le PèreMagloire ( http://surfcity.kund.dalnet.se/nomonhan.htm ) ne coïncident pas tout à fait.
Pour l'un, le premier combat se déroule au-dessus de Hamar-Daba, pour le second au nord de Amkuro.
Les effectifs mentionnés laissent également place à l'interprétation. Selon BA, 21 I-16/I-15b affrontent 9+9 ki-27 avant qu'une autre escadrille de I-16 n'intervienne.
> A votre avis, quel effectif peut-on compter pour cette escadrille ?
Pour qu'il corresponde aux chiffres du second récit (qui lui n'évoque qu'une seule formation VVS de 60 avions), il faudrait mettre de nouveau une quarantaine d'avions en l'air...

Là, ça risque de faire lourd mais on verra bien. Par contre, y a-t-il moyen de forcer les appareils d'un camp à se replier, fuyant la zone de combat, via le FMB ?
J'ai l'impression qu'ils restent dans la zone de combat tant qu'ils ont des munitions sans que le timing des wp soit respecté, une fois la lutte engagée.

[Krasno]

Peut-être peux-tu essayer de limiter leur carburant ? J'avoue que je ne sais pas si ça marche, mais c'est la première idée qui m'est venue à l'esprit.

[PatCartier]

Purée j'y avais pas pensé...

[LEPEREMAGLOIRE]

Dans le lien que je t'ai donné:
http://surfcity.kund.dalnet.se/nomonhan.htm
Les combats sont plus important que çà:

22 June 1939
During the afternoon, 49 I-152 and 56 I-16s from 22 and 70 IAPs crossed the border at Amkuro, south-east of Kanjur, and the 2nd chutai of the 24th Sentai took off to intercept, followed by the 1st chutai. The 2nd chutai encountered a reported 60 fighters and in the ensuing combat claimed 18 shot down for the loss of four; including the CO Captain Shigenobu Morimoto (Class 42), Sergeant Major Yoshio Yoshino (NCO67), Sergeant Major Kunizo Ishizuka (NCO73), which all three were killed and Sergeant Major Yotutaka Miyajima (NCO54) who was taken POW. A fifth fighter force-landed and the pilot returned later. Meanwhile, the 1st chutai joined the combat somewhat later, claiming six more victories.
An hour later, there was another alarm and the 1st chutai took off again, engaging ten plus I-152 and a similar number of I-16s. The 2nd chutai had followed, and at once entered the fight, the 24th Sentai’s units together claiming 25 further victories, this time without loss. It seems that eight probables were also claimed.
During the second engagement, Captain Saiji Kani (leader of the 1st chutai) claimed five victories and later described the combat: [INDENT]"How many enemy aircraft there were; but we have the courage, like eagles pursuing swallows, and overwhelmed the enemy. About 5.30 pm I spotted 25-26 more flying at about 2,000 metres - on the first pass one was going down in flames, and one by one others went down in the same way - more new enemy aircraft appeared and entered the battle - they were all around - we left the area of fighting and returned. There were many hits in the wings and tail of my aircraft." [/INDENT]First Lieutenant Shoichi Suzuki of the 1st chutai claimed five victories during the day, but was hit and wounded in his right wrist. Attempting to head for home, he was chased persistently by three Soviet fighters, so turning on these, he shot down all three to bring his total for the day to eight. He was hospitalized next month after this combat.
During the day, Sergeant Major Koji Ishizawa of the 2nd chutai claimed two victories during his first combat flying in First Lieutenant Furakwa's element. However, in this engagement most of the Japanese pilots were hit and wounded, only Ishizawa and one other pilot escaping unscathed. Katsuaki Kira flew as wingman to First Lieutenant Furakawa and claimed one I-16 as his first victory in his first combat.
First Lieutenant Hyoe Yonaga a section leader of the 2nd chutai, 24th Sentai, experienced his first combat when Captain Morimoto led nine Ki-27 from the chutai over the Khalka River, where some 60 enemy fighters were seen in three groups. Yonaga was able to claim one and one shared, but Captain Morimoto was lost and First Lieutenant Furukawa was wounded, yonaga having to take over as chutai leader until the arrival of Captain Tashiro at the end of the month.
Sergeant Major Goro Nishihara of the 2nd chutai, 24th Sentai, experienced his first combat when flying as third man in Lieutenant Hyoe Yonaga's element. He and eight other pilots attacked 60 Soviet fighters, the combat allowing him to claim three shot down and a fourth probably so.
Chiyoji Saito of the 2nd chutai, 24th Sentai, flew as third pilot in Captain Morimoto's element and claimed three and one probable, but lost sight of his leader, who failed to return.
Sergeant Major Yutaka Kimura of the 1st chutai reportedly claimed one enemy fighter, but then a large 'gaggle' of Soviet fighters attacked, breaking up the Japanese formation. Kimura pulled out of the melee, then dived back in, attacking one after another until he had claimed five destroyed. His own Ki-27 was hit 21 times, several bullets puncturing the fuel tanks, which started to leak. Overcome by fumes, he passed out whilst in a tight turn, and his aircraft fell out of the sky. Just above the ground, he recovered and managed to regain control, heading for base. Seven or eight I-16s gave chase persistently, but eventually he turned into these, evading their attacks for 30 minutes during which he managed to claim yet another shot down before shaking off the rest and making it back to base.
During the second sortie of the day, Sergeant Major Shogo Saito of the 1st chutai, 24th Sentai, claimed three enemy aircraft shot down, forced a fourth pilot to bale out, and then strafed the three downed aircraft. With his ammunition gone, he was attacked by eight I-16s. He at once flew at one of these head-on, and when the I-16 pilot sought to fly below him, cut off its tail with his right wing, seeing it go down. He managed to regain control of his aircraft, flying back to base with half the wing gone. His damaged Ki-27 was later exhibited in Tokyo.
During the two combats, it seems that 17 Japanese fighters totally claimed 50 victories and 8 probables while losing four fighters.
Returning Soviet pilots claimed that they had been in combat with 120(!) Japanese fighters of which they claimed 30 shot down. Known claiming pilots from the 22 IAP were:
Mayor Nikolay Georgiyvich Glazykin (CO) two enemy aircraft
Grigoriy Kravchenko one enemy aircraft
Starshiy Leytenant Viktor Rakhov (I-16) one enemy aircraft
Anton Yakimenko (I-16) two enemy aircraft
Arseniy Vorozheikin (I-16) one enemy aircraft
R. Raykov one enemy aircraft.
Known claiming pilots from the 70 IAP were:
Mayor Sergey Gritsevets (I-16) one Ki-27 Unknown units:
Nikolay Semenovich Gerasimov one enemy aircraft
Viktorov one enemy aircraft.
Mayor Ivan Lakeev, a unit commander in the 1st Army Group, also claimed an enemy aircraft.
It seems that ten I-152 and three I-16s were shot down. Eleven pilots were killed. Among these was Mayor Nikolay Georgiyvich Glazykin, commander of 22 IAP, who was credited with two victories witnessed by his fellow pilots. Five more pilots of 22 IAP was killed along with five from 70 IAP. One pilot from each of the regiments survived being shot down.
Yevgenii Stepanov took part in this combat flying in the lead of his 4th Eskadrilya of 22 IAP (nine I-152) and three aircraft, including Stepanov’s I-152, made forced-landing after the combat. These three aircraft were destroyed by Japanese fighters strafing them but all three pilots survived. A fourth pilot, Sakin, commander of an eskadrilya of twelve I-16s was wounded when his force-landed I-16 was destroyed by strafing Japanese fighters.
Arseniy Vorozheikin of 22 IAP suffered damage to his fighter during his first encounter in this conflict.

[PatCartier]

En effet. Justement je me demande si le différentiel ne pourrait pas provenir de l'escadrille de I-16 du 70 IAP qui intervient sur le tard (selon BA n°50, lors du premier combat de la journée).

[PatCartier]

Les skins de I-16 type 5 passent avec les types 10. Les deux sont des avions moddés si je ne m'abuse; ça laisse à penser que le pb vient de là puisque les skins dont j'avais voulu les affubler avaient été conçues à l'origine pour des I-17 stock, bien que représentant des appareils type 10.

[FR_jmchaps]

Hello!
Petit déterrage car j'ai en projet cette campagne mais coté VVS.
Pour le moment je glâne infos, docs, et je noircis des pages pour mettre à plat un déroulement chronologique cohérent.

J'ai aussi le BA n°50 et j'ai commandé ce bouquin:


A suivre....

[PatCartier]

Si tu veux je te passe le template (terrains et front "enjolivés") de la map.

[FR_jmchaps]

Merci PatCartier, je l'ai déja telechargé mais je vais partir de la Map nue même si je te piquerai quelques aménagements que j'ai trouvé judicieux et qui me plaisent bien.